HOMEMADE GUNS INFO!





From Newsgroups   misc.survivalism

Subject   Re   Homemade guns

Date   16 Dec 1996 15  10  03 -0700



Ok campers!!



In reference to the original post, you can make a zip gun of this

kind relatively safely, although it would be illegal as hell in Canada, as

I recall.  In reference to the "bolt or something for a firing pin", you

can use a roofing nail in a pinch.  



NOTE   If you make the firing pin too long IT WILL PIERCE THE PRIMER.



	THIS MAKES THE CARTRIDGE EXPLODE!!!



If it's too sharp, that'll also cause it to piecre the primer (something

to check for when you're inspecting your "real" firearms too).  Use a

file, or spend a few minutes rubbing the tip of the nail on a sharpening

stone (or a brick, the sidewalk, etc) to "break" the point.  You want to

fairly small, _rounded_ tip to fire the primer.



When I was in the military, I was a unit and battalion level armorer, 

as well as a ground pounder.  I can personally attest to the bad things that 

a pierced primer can do to a solid weapon like the M60 machinegun.  



I shudder to think what the end result would be to a fellow (or lady) using

a couple of lengths of pipe!



Not sure I'd call an M60 a "solid weapon," but still, stronger than some

plumbing scrap...  There's a reason not to try making a pipe gun for rifle

cartridges   the pressures are a _lot_ higher, and it takes good quality

materials and careful workmanship to produce a weapon that can safely fire

a high power rifle round.  Stick to _low_ pressure handgun rounds (.38

Special [the anemic loadings], .38 S&W, .45 ACP, etc), low-power shotgun

rounds (no 12 gage 3" magnums) and .22 rimfire rounds.





From: Bob Yates <byates19@pop.intellinet.com 

Newsgroups: misc.survivalism

Subject: Re: Homemade guns

Date: Tue, 03 Dec 1996 22:06:49 -0800



As a resident of the PRK (Peoples' Republik of Kanada), I've been

thinking a lot lately about alternative weapons to use in emergency

situations.  On a Web site earlier today I read a story in which the

main character made these home-made shotguns using 3/4" steel pipe, 1"

steel pipe and 1" steel pipe caps.  I got the impression that the

stories on this page were meant to educate as well as entertain, much

like the "Gray Nineties" on-line novel, whose author and URL escapes .

  

Basically, you cut a 6" length of 1" pipe, thread one end and cap it.



A 12" length of 3/4" pipe is your "barrel".  Into one end (the

"chamber") you stuff a 12-GA shotgun shell, and then ram it into the

6" section.  At this point it supposedly fires, but I'd imagine I'd

need to drill through the center of the cap and put a bolt through to

use as a firing pin.  Devastating in urban/indoor scenarios, plus you

have a foot-long steel clu the initial shock of the blast.

  

Now, I've never tried this, and really wouldn't want to in peacetime

since it's illegal as hell and probably quite dangerous.  But, after

TEOTWAWKI, I reckon that one (or ten) of these would be the only

"firearm(s)" that I could get right away. Maybe enough to help me

"liberate" a real rifle from a bad guy or at least "take one with me".



So,  does this sound _reasonably_ safe to use or am I begging for

tragedy and dismemberment here?  The source seems pretty reputable

based on his previous books and articles, but you never know...

  

  

Try doing a search for Kurt Saxon, his web site has a little more

detailed instruction for a slam-fire shotgun.  Good Luck





Newsgroups: misc.survivalism

Subject: Re: Homemade guns

Date: 13 Dec 1996 16:23:02 -0700



Hmmm...anybody got any pointers to a good gunsmithing manual or other source 

of training? (I already can find my way around a machine shop, but that's 

about all I know about the subject) "See at the bottom for that info"



How complicated do you want to get?



There're a number of books that have information on the sort of "bare

bones" pipe shotguns and such that started this thread.  _Methods of Riot

Control_ (or something similar to that) by Rex Applegate has some line

drawings showing the construction of pipe guns. 



Improvised Modified Firearms_ by Truby and Minnery is primarily a history 

of the manufacture and use of homemade guns, but is has a good number of 

interesting and useful photos...



R Dunlop's _Gunsmithing_ is a pretty good general reference.  



Copies of the Gun Parts Corporation's catalog, and/or the various gun

disassmebly guides published by DBI, the NRA and so on are useful.



The simplest design (other than the slam-fired pipe shotguns) is an

open-bolt blowback submachinegun of the Sten sort.  There're a number of

booklets published by companies like Paladin Press (I dunno if Paladin

actually publishes one, but a number of their competitors do) that give

details on making such weapons.



Not _too_ complicated, but quite illegal; as these are firearms under the

purview of the National Firearms Act and the Firearm Owners Protection Act

which can not be legally possessed by civilians.



Since frames/receivers are the only legally restricted parts currently in

the US, it's probably easiest and most cost effective to purchase parts to

be assembled to/modified to fit a homebrew receiver.  The Browning

machineguns, for example, are a good source of parts for this.  



The controlled part of the M1917/M1919 and M2 machineguns is the right

sideplate of the receiver assembly.  But the firing stresses are actually

handled by the barrel/barrel extension/bolt/bolt lock combination (the

barrel screws into the barrel extension, which has rails in which rides

the bolt, and a slot in which rides the bolt lock, which locks into the

bottom of the bolt to lock the action closed during firing.  



Find a copy of the maintenance manual for the Browning MGs for a diagram 

of how this works...  There's actually a .50 BMG rifle sold by a company 

out of south Florida that uses this; the kit consists of an aluminum plate 

receiver parts set that the buyer "manufactures" (by drilling and tapping 

the plates and bolting the plates together), and the buyer supplies a number

of M2 and M3 .50 BMG machinegun parts to complete the rifle (no provison

for a belt or magazine feed system, so no fears about "manufacturing a

machinegun").  



I've examined one, and it seems like it'd work fine, and be safe enough, 

since all the firing stresses are handled by GI surplus M2 parts.  



But the builder wasn't quite up to letting me fire a couple of

test rounds out the back door of his garage, so I can't speak as to the

effectiveness or accuracy...



A _very_ basic singleshot rifle could be made from M1919 parts; though

you'd need to fabricate some means of mounting the action.  I suspect

extraction would be a pain in the ass as well, since there's not the

recoiling bolt being accelerated away from the barrel as in the M1919

machinegun.  



Trying to manually open the bolt using the bolt handle might be difficult; 

but I'd be very hesitant to try using lubed cases or any such to get around 

this.  



A better method of firing would have to be cobbled together as well; 

since the Browning MGs use a long trigger bar to force down the sear in 

the back of the bolt.



Currently, M1919A4 parts are available from a number of dealers at very

low prices.  I think Sarco's been selling barrels with poor bores for

about $20 for example, and the other parts aren't too terribly expensive.



One could also try making a frame for a low-power handgun by soldering

together laminations of sheet brass.  This was used for some of the

earliest revolvers; it'll loosen up eventually, but should be safe enough

if one sticks to low-pressure chamberings like .38 S&W or the weaker .38

Special loads.  Use H&R top-break parts to part out the frame.  Might be

possible to do this with a S&W design as well.  But you'd be relying on

your ability to backengineer the frame from a collection of parts...



An AR-15-type lower receiver could probably be made this way as well.  The

lower doesn't handle the firing stress, so laminated brass would be plenty

strong (there're carbon fiber receivers being advertised for example, and

the Canadians are using a plastic lower for their .22 LR training version

of the M16 (C-something, C-10?).  



Even simpler would be a sheet metal assembly fitted to an AR-15 upper 

receiver assembly: a parallel-sided unit fastened by bolts to the take-down 

pin holes in the upper receiver, and drilled to take pins for the trigger/sear 

and hammer assemblies.  



If you could rig a recoil spring/buffer tube arrangement, you could use the

appropriate parts, or just remove the gas tube and manually extract the

fired cases (might want to fit something to deflect the gas from the port 

in the front sight assembly away from your eyes though).



But unless you're interested in this for its own sake, I wouldn't spend

the money.  You'd be much better off buying a surplus Mauser or

Lee-Enfield for $80-$150 and, if you're worried about legal hassles,

laying out the money for a hunting license (even if it's never used) every

year to pass yourself off as a hunter in case "they" want an excuse for

your owning a rifle. 



MORE INFO ON HOW TO:



Newsgroups: misc.survivalism

Subject: Re: Homemade guns

Date: 14 Dec 1996 15:26:12 -0500



Yes, you want a two volume set called "The Modern Gunsmith" (circa 1930)



   It has information related to virtually every aspect of the

manufacture (including making springs/tempering steels, drilling and

rifling of bores and much more).  I like it for the discussion of

steels and tempering alone, but the rest is good also...  ;)